51: How to Heal from Infidelity with Andrea Giles

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Feb 8

This week I have a special guest Andrea Giles, Infidelity Coach and host of the Heal from Infidelity podcast on how to heal from cheating in relationships. Andrea and I discuss what to do when you’re at the beginning of your healing journey, how to heal emotionally, and why so many people can feel impatient and frustrated.

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We also answer two listener questions - one about how to heal resentment and how to decided whether to stay or go, and another about anger and rage and if there has to be something wrong in a relationship for cheating to occur.

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New View Advice Infidelity Hub - One-Stop-Shop for all things related to infidelity

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Timestamps ⏱️

0:00 Introduction to Episode
1:55: Intro with Andrea Giles
11:21: Listener Question 1
28:55 - Listener Question 2

Learn More About Andrea Giles:

Certified Life Coach Andrea Giles is the host of the "Heal from Infidelity" podcast, as well as mother to 12 in a big blended family. Her main coaching focus lies in helping women decide to stay or go after infidelity in her signature program, "Know in 90." In addition to coaching and taking care of her family, Andrea loves good music, being outside, and traveling anywhere and everywhere.

Connect with Andrea Giles:

Podcast: Heal from Infidelity
Instagram: @andrea.giles.coaching
Facebook: Andrea Giles Coaching
Or check out her website: https://andreagiles.com/

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This podcast was transcribed by an AI tool called Otter. Please forgive any typos or errors.
Amanda Durocher 0:01
Welcome to New View Advice, a safe place for you to ask your most vulnerable questions about life, relationships, healing, and so much more. I'm your host, Amanda Durocher and I believe our fears and traumas are often what holds us back from living life to the fullest. Join me here each week as I offer advice on how to move through whatever is holding you back from being your best self. Let's get started. Hi, beautiful souls. My name is Amanda and this is New View Advice.
Amanda Durocher 0:30
If you're new here, this is a healing centered advice podcast where I offer guidance for the healing journey. It is not my intention to give you the answers. I believe you have all the answers you seek. You just may need a new view and a little guidance along the way. Thank you for joining me for today's episode. Today I am joined by Andrea Giles, who will be helping me answer to listener questions about healing from infidelity. I am so grateful that Andrea has agreed to come on the podcast and is offering her wisdom today. For anyone unfamiliar with Andrea. Andrea is a certified life coach and the host of the podcast heal from infidelity, as well as a mother to 12. In a big blended family. Her main coaching focus lies in helping women decide to stay or go after infidelity. In her signature program no in 90. In addition to coaching and taking care of her family, Andrea loves good music, being outside and traveling anywhere and everywhere. Today, Andrea and I will be answering two questions. One question is from a listener who is indecisive about if they should stay or go after being cheated on. And the second question is from a listener who feels a lot of rage and anger right now after being cheated on, and wants to know if there has to always be something wrong in the relationship when somebody cheats. So I'm excited for you to listen to this episode. And to hear more about Andrea and her wisdom she has to share. So let's get started.
Amanda Durocher 1:56
Welcome to New View Advice. As you know from the intro, today I am speaking with Andrea Giles, and we'll be speaking about healing from infidelity. As many of you know, this is a very popular topic that I received so many questions about and that I've learned through doing this podcast so many people struggle with. So I'm so grateful that Andrea has agreed to come on and share her wisdom with us. Hi, Andrea, thank you for being here.
Andrea Giles 2:21
Hello. Thank you so much. Very excited to be here.
Amanda Durocher 2:24
If you don't know already, Andrea actually has a podcast heal from infidelity, which is how I found Andrea when I was searching for different resources to learn more about this topic. And I think Andrea does such an amazing job with her podcast. The episodes are short, they're digestible. And I just love how you are able to speak about the healing journey from infidelity in such a grounded way. It feels really accessible. And I feel like your podcast offers so many people hope on their own journeys. I was wondering if you could share with us how you decided to start your podcast.
Andrea Giles 2:58
Sure. So I'll just tell you a little bit about how like my business journey started from a personal journey. I experienced a lot of betrayal and deceit things like that in my first marriage. And I ended up getting divorced and navigated a lot of different things. Part of that was like we got divorced. And then seven months after we got divorced, he was killed in a car accident. And just like a lot of stuff happened. And I knew at the time that somehow I was going to be helping women who were navigating some of the same things. I just knew it. And then through different experiences, I thought that it was going to look like therapy. And then coaching was presented to me, I'm like, Nope, this is it. This is what I'm doing. And so five years ago, I jumped in and did a bunch of certifications and trainings and all kinds of things to to go ahead and hang up my coaching shingle and get started. And in 2020, at the beginning of the year, I just had a lot of people much like yourself asking questions and wanting more digestible, right information that they could just listen to anytime. And so I decided it's time it's time to start a podcast and put it out there. And when I did it, I had I was so scared. I was so nervous. And the image that I had in my head is thinking about people who you know, it was like 2am and they're just like, I just don't, I don't know what to do. My world just blew up. I was picturing them putting air pods in or whatever headphones on and just picking an episode and turning it on and getting some kind of guidance, some kind of comfort, some kind of peace, something that can help them to feel more settled and feel more productive like they're getting somewhere. So that's really how my podcast was born was with that image and thinking of the people who just like in real time like right Right now I need some help.
Amanda Durocher 5:01
Yeah, I love that. And I can see that visual too, because I see that with my podcasts as well. I think a lot of people find my podcasts, different rock bottom moments. Yeah, at those moments where people are like, okay, something needs to change. A lot of times that happens through trauma through a traumatic experience, or it happens years later, when you're finally ready to look at the trauma. Yeah, that's a visual I have as well. So I think that's beautiful that you created it for that.
Andrea Giles 5:26
Awesome, thank you,
Amanda Durocher 5:29
with all the different clients you work with. And throughout your own journey, I was wondering what your biggest piece of advice would be for somebody who's just at the beginning of their journey,
Andrea Giles 5:39
I would say to somebody who's at the beginning, that I know that it feels like your life just blew up like that the things that you thought were are not many of the things that you thought were like your foundation might feel totally rocked. And what I would say to people in that space is to trust the process of that this is going to help push you forward and your own growth, like many other things, don't, it's something that like buses open so much, that it is an opportunity to really take a hard look at lots of different parts of our lives and very intentionally build a life that we really want to be in. And so right now, it feels like your life's just been demolished. Right? And I would say, yeah, I get it. It does feel that way. And you have so much to look forward to. And you're gonna blow your own mind with what you build from this place. And just trust the process. It doesn't happen to have to happen today. You don't have to have any answers today. But it's coming. It is sincerely an opportunity to create a really intentional life.
Amanda Durocher 6:47
I love that. And I can second that and say that I think that's so true as well. Throughout my own healing journey. I've found the same thing where most people who listen to this podcast already know. But my background is that I came to the healing journey through sexual assault and rape. And it's another thing that is similar where you feel like you're at a rock bottom. But the journey back home to myself was one of the best gifts I've ever given myself. Yeah, you get it. Beautiful. Yeah,
Amanda Durocher 7:15
it was so interesting. I did a healing circle for people who had been cheated on in the fall. And there's so much mirrored in the sexual assault in the cheating journey. The feelings of betrayal, the feelings of anger and rage, the feelings of confusion, the feelings of being like out of your body, because of what has happened to you. I just thought it was so interesting. I've never seen it before. But doing this circle with these women, I was like, wow, I see myself in you even though my traumas different, but these are universal human emotions. And they're very deep ones that are very uncomfortable. And both of these traumas bring people kind of to their knees to that praying moment where you're like, Okay, God, what do I do?
Andrea Giles 7:54
Yep, totally, totally. Like, I think sometimes extreme pain can be a doorway to walk through to get to this place of just that, like you said, the rock bottom, all of that the intense emotion, all the questions, all of the things, it can be like this doorway that opens up into a place of more truth, more intention, more, more joy, more of everything that we just didn't know before. Like, it's like a demolition that can bring forth so much good. And beauty.
Amanda Durocher 8:28
Yeah, I love that perspective. I know I'm seeing it kind of like you're like you have a house that's built on a faulty foundation. Yes, you know, and you keep building on top of it. And it's moments like these that send everything to the ground, and then you get the chance to rebuild it with a strong
Andrea Giles 8:43
foundation. Yep, yep. Exactly. Yeah. On purpose.
Amanda Durocher 8:47
Yes. On purpose and with intention. Yep.
Andrea Giles 8:50
I agree. I just got off a call with a client who, like they're there. They're navigating rebuilding. And something that I say all the time in this new building phase is that it has to be sustainable. And what I mean by that is like to that house analogy, if we're just like, you know, the houses that go up, and they're like, it looks like they just got thrown up. Do you know what I mean? Like, oh, and new neighborhoods, like, oh my gosh, there's five new houses that just sprung out of nowhere, right? That is not the goal. And a lot of times we we think that we need to hurry we need to hurry and patch this up and put this back together or whether you're staying or going after infidelity. Like I need to get better I need to hurry and put this behind me and move forward. And that is just not true. It's not true. What the goal here is, is building sustainably building something that's going to last and even if it takes a little bit longer, even if it's more uncomfortable now than it would be to just patch something up and slap it you know, put a wall up put a picture on it call it good, right? Just the sustainability piece is ultimate They what's going to bring you the most joy and safety and loving the space that you've built? Yeah, I
Amanda Durocher 10:06
love that I was actually going to ask you about that because I think the impatience part because I have so many people who write into me or feeling so impatient with how long the healing is taking or impatient with making their decisions, they feel like they should know right away, should I say Should I leave? And I think like you said, it's you're building a sustainable foundation. These are things I believe you should take time to reflect on. No decisions need to be made right away. And also the healing, it takes time. And that's part of the beauty of it is I learned through my healing journey patients
Andrea Giles 10:40
Exactly. Like we don't need to be in a hurry. In fact, as we kind of let things unfold, and go like a natural course, I say that with caution, because sometimes the natural course can be disastrous when we let like our, our lower brain take over. So by natural course, I mean, like with intention, but not pushing and rushing the process and trying to make ourselves go faster.
Amanda Durocher 11:06
I think that that's actually a great place to jump into the first question, because I feel like I could send some impatience in this first question. So let's jump on in.
Amanda Durocher [listener question] 11:23
Two months ago, I found out my girlfriend of five years was hooking up with a co worker. When I confronted her about the situation, she broke down and was completely remorseful and overcome with guilt. Her justification was that she let curiosity get the better of her and was worried that when we got married 10 or so years down the track, she might be curious. My issue now is that when I dig down deep within myself, and ask myself how I feel towards her, the voice says, I don't like her, she's hurt me. But prior to her cheating, I was the happiest man on the planet. I've been strong these last two months to try and give it time to maybe he'll instead of instantly breaking it off. But as time goes on, I resent her more and more. I really liked the point you made about not painting them with the once a cheater, always a cheater brush, because this mistake was extremely out of character for her. But I did nothing wrong in this scenario. And I don't know if I'm strong enough to be able to move past it. Do you have any tools, resources or advice to help me decide what to do next? Next?
Andrea Giles 12:20
Thank you. Okay, so one key piece that jumped out there at me is about the resentment. And to this to this person that sent in this question, what I would say to you, and to all of you listening is that resentment can be a really helpful signal that have some specific things to look at. Okay. Resentment is born from a few different things. One main reason we resent is because there's things that we need, that we think that we can't have, and it's somebody else's fault. Like it's directed towards the person that we are resenting, okay, so in this situation, you're feeling resentment towards her. The cure for resentment is first of all, owning your own resentment, and looking at what's it actually about? Like, what are my fears here? What are my needs? What are the things that I want here that I think I can't now have, because of her? That's one huge piece of resentment. Another huge piece of resentment is when we become more responsible for something for in this case, it's your relationship, right? Like when we take on more responsibility than what is ours. When other people are just as capable. We often feel resentment towards them. It's called over functioning, it's when we kind of put this burden on ourselves to fix it, to override some of our own feelings, our own experience with it, to try to just keep this relationship together. Resentment can come up there, because there's things that we are trying to take responsibility for that never were ours in the first place. They're not ours to carry. And so what I would say to you, what are you taking responsibility for that you can set down that you can just hand back and say, You know what, this piece was not mine. I did hear in there like the I can't remember the exact phrasing but and none of it was mine. None of it was my fault. Even with that piece, I want to give some caution to saying that, okay, this is kind of an unpopular opinion. Are you ready? I'm gonna jump in. We all help co create the relationships we're in. We do. We co create them. Yes. So true, and it's kind of a harsh reality. Now, do we drive somebody to go cheat on us? That's a big fat no for me, like do we make somebody Go cheat on us. No, we sure don't. Okay, that where where we can contribute? And where I see this relationship in danger in the future is is there a climate of like, radical honesty, even if it's really hard to hear our we a completely safe person to talk to, like, what's it like to be with us? Like, am I somebody that if she came to me and said, Hey, I'm really afraid that we're gonna get 10 years into this marriage, and I'm gonna wonder what I missed. If I'm going to wonder if there are things that I, whatever, you know, and asking yourself, how would I have responded and being honest to that, it might be that you were very grateful for her being honest with you, and that you could have navigated it and work through it. That's very possible. But looking at what's the part that I helped contribute to, to create the kind of relationship where this happened? And am I wiser now? Like, how am I being wiser now, those are a few thoughts here looking at where you might be hiding a little bit behind resentment. Hiding, I say hiding because we can use resentment to avoid situations to avoid conversations to avoid moving forward to really move forward for from this in a sustainable way. That's not going to burn you guys to the ground, right? Like it, like Amanda said earlier, about, you know, building a home, we want it to be structurally sound and resentment is a killer. Hmm. Resentment is something that can just burn it to the ground. If it's, it's like it can become this out of control fire. And so I suggest taking full ownership of the resentment. And looking at where there's things that you want that are not being met owning them, they're yours. And instead of blaming her for those things, how can you be courageous and step into a conversation, where you're very clear about this is this is what I need here. This is what I want here is something that you can that you can help with? Is this something you can do, and resentment kind of melts away, when we see that somebody is willing to to look at those things with us. And on the flip side, if they're not, it's good to know. I call it data collecting, we're just gathering data Good to know, okay, this is somebody that maybe is not invested in creating something that is super sustainable and strong, they might be more interested in a patch up job, and that just does not work for me.
Amanda Durocher 17:43
I think that you hit it like the nail on the head with the resentment piece. The other thing that stuck out to me with this question was that I wonder, I think this person has a lot of self awareness, and has been really in their head about this situation. And I think, as you suggested, I think communicating and learning to communicate, is going to be a key thing moving forward in this relationship. And I wonder how much you've expressed, what you're expressing here to your partner. And also with those thoughts you're having? My question to you would be how much have you allowed yourself to feel this experience? Yeah, I find with a lot of people who write in, they have a lot of self awareness, they can analyze what happened. But have you allowed yourself to feel and grieve the relationship you once had? Amen. Because I heard you say it on one of your episodes, Andrea, but if you stay or if you go, you're creating a new relationship. So that old relationship no longer exists. And you have to go through a grieving process. And you will not just be able to skip that part. You can't skip the feeling the feelings part? Nope.
Andrea Giles 18:54
Perfect. Perfect advice. Yeah, like that goes back to with resentment. Sometimes some of the things that we resent are, we do need to process these emotions, it is an absolute need. It's not just a thing for when it's convenient, or on a day when I have nothing better to do. Right? Like it, it is absolutely essential. And the other piece here that can be really hard and uncomfortable, is that when we are looking at the possibility of staying in relationships, we gotta let other people in on it and not hide it from them. Like not hide from them what we are processing. And the beautiful thing here is I see a lot that sometimes my clients are really afraid to do this like to really let their partner see and sometimes the partners will say, When are you going to move past this? When is what why do you need to keep bringing it up? I said I'm sorry. I don't care. I like if you're going to build something sustainable. We get to be in our feelings and we get to share Are them and take responsibility for them. That doesn't mean attacking it doesn't mean we still have to own how we express them that still are ours to carry, right? It doesn't mean free rein to be me, right, we still have to take ownership of how we show up in these conversations. But sometimes just giving ourselves permission to say, I'm gonna let this person see how deeply this hurt me. I'm gonna let them see me cry, I'm gonna let them see me like this really deeply hurt me, and seeing how this other person can be there with you. And that is a big deal. Right? Like, can they can they be there with me? So, yeah, absolutely full permission to go into the emotion and really feel it and let your partner be a witness to it.
Amanda Durocher 20:50
Yeah, I love that the inviting your partner in to witness that process. Because, like you were saying, we have to take responsibility for those emotions. So the resentment is yours, the anger is yours. But it's also communicating that those are present is a big part of creating, I believe, a healthy relationship.
Andrea Giles 21:08
Yep. And the other side of this coin here is that the more that we honor ourselves, and have these conversations and and like share our emotions, things like that. It's a beautiful thing, because we're actually inviting the other people in our lives to do the same. So for example, yes, so much of the time with the person who cheated. Oh, they're, they're so buried in shame, like, so much shame, so much guilt. Most of the people that I work with, they, they didn't seek out to cheat on their partner or their spouse, whatever, they weren't planning on it, right? They, it's something that they came by honestly, that they're looking at themselves and go, I can't believe that I'm was that person, I did this, this is real. And for them, they will want more than anything to move forward and never talk about it again, never bring it up, because it's so painful. And so when we can be honest, and really share not from an manipulative way, not from a punishing way, but from a real, this is what this is, for me. This is how this feels for me. And if we share it with our partners, it gives them an opportunity to feel with you, for them to heal, guess what they need to feel all of it too, and not run from it. And so it's really an invitation to allow them to step into whatever they're feeling guilt, shame, sadness, grief, loss, all of these things, and creating the safe place for all of it.
Amanda Durocher 22:38
Yes, I love that. I love that you touched on that. Because some of my one on one clients are people who have cheated, and they really suffer with the shame. Don't know how they got there. And what I hear a lot of times is what's the hardest part for them is that shutdown of the other person is the I don't want to talk about this. And I've heard it from both ends for people who've been cheated on or people have cheated, that when the other person closes the door to that emotional conversation. It doesn't help the process. So it's really learning how can we communicate together these tough issues. And again, this is like, the foundation was Rocky, if you weren't able to communicate about a lot of these things. I think a lot of us go into relationships and don't have great communication patterns. And a situation like this is unfortunate, but it can really teach us how to communicate better with the people we're building a life with.
Andrea Giles 23:29
Yes. And we have a strong motivation to do it, right. Like everything is on the line. So let's just do this.
Amanda Durocher 23:37
And I just want to offer that I think when you do learn to communicate about your feelings, you'll realize you actually enjoy it. A lot of people don't like feeling feelings. I get a lot of questions about that. Like I said, I get a lot of people in their heads. And when you learn to appreciate your feelings and the information behind your feelings, it's very therapeutic to start talking about your feelings, and it's very freeing. In a world that doesn't want us to talk about our feelings. It can be really scary. But when you start to do it, you realize it's actually a natural part of being human. Mm hmm.
Andrea Giles 24:12
Yep, I would agree completely, like, oh my gosh, I didn't die. Like I shared, like from, like, from my depths, you know, really shared, I let somebody see me and allowed myself to feel it fully. And I'm still here, and I feel better, like amazing, right? Like I actually feel better. So yes.
Amanda Durocher 24:34
Do you have any other suggestions or piece of advice for this listener?
Andrea Giles 24:40
Yeah, I have one more thing. I think that one really important piece is looking at where you think you should do a certain thing, or should be a certain way because sometimes the truth of the matter is, yeah, I do recommend doing the work to heal whether you stay or whether you go not to let it consume you for years to come like that as a necessity, but giving yourself full permission, like if I gave myself full permission to leave, like really settling into that if I could just say, You know what I want to heal, I want to rebuild myself. But I don't know that I want to do that here giving yourself full permission. There's no shut here of what you should do. And really, it's about what you have the bandwidth for what, you know, there's a lot that goes into rebuilding a relationship. There's mind work, there's bodywork, there's all these different things that need to happen. And it's like, is this yes, I'm going to do this anyway, for myself. But is this a place where I want to put that effort? And it's okay, if it's not, it's okay to give yourself permission not to, in fact, for my clients who they're like, No, I've got we got to make this work. It's really amazing. Because when they give themselves permission not to like I actually could just say, I don't want to, I think I'm going to do something else. When they give themselves actual permission, like really go there. They give themselves permission to fully choose to really step into it and go, Oh, actually, this is what I want. But it's not until you give yourself full permission to leave, like really feel it, like I do not have to stay. And I don't have to justify my reasons for leaving, I don't have to explain it to anybody, I don't even need to explain it to myself. Like I can just decide that this, this is not for me, this is not a place that I want to continue. And I can still love this person and decide that this is the end for us that this is the end of this chapter, it's complete. And giving yourself permission to do that is where for those who decide to step back into the relationship, it's so much more intentional. It's so much deeper from this, knowing that this is what I want. And it makes the work of rebuilding so much more powerful, intentional, clear of what needs to happen, rather than kind of feeling this resentment because like I have to stay here or I'm just a jerk, I'm just giving up too quick. I'm not being forgiving. I'm not being loving, like, let those things go and really give yourself full permission. Either way, step into it, feel it.
Amanda Durocher 27:23
I love that. I love that. Because yes, relationships are a choice. And returning to the choice to be in them. I talk a lot about shoulds and how shoulds want to like the most dangerous words in the English language because we torment ourselves with what we should be doing what our life should look like. should, should should. And in order to be intentional, it's coming back to like you said that choice. And I think that for this listener that might really help with the indecision, they're feeling about how they feel like they've been powering on for two months, and they don't know what to do that really sitting in the choice, that it's a choice to stay in. It's a choice to leave. I also like you said, I think that'll help with the resentment as well.
Andrea Giles 28:04
Like, no one's making me right, like I can leave. What do I actually want, right? a sure bet is betting on yourself, that by going all in on on this work, you're going to come out in a really good place. And I really do believe that a place of a lot more wisdom, and maybe painfully earned but a lot more wisdom nonetheless.
Amanda Durocher 28:27
Yeah, the inner works hard. I think there's a reason not everybody does it, you know, it's difficult. But when you commit to yourself, it's it's a journey home to self. And it's a beautiful place to be but it doesn't mean it's easy every day. Thank you so much for this question. And we are sending you so much love as you continue to heal. And as you navigate this chapter and figure out what's best for you.
Amanda Durocher [listener question] 28:59
Hi, Amanda. My fiance cheated on me two years ago. It has been a truly traumatic experience. I have trust issues, fear of rejection and abandonment. I feel I have done a lot of healing on this journey. And I know the healing never really stops and that it does have layers. With my current fiance i did a complete 360 Instead of playing out my trust issues. Also I had done a lot of emotional healing and therapy. I fully and wholeheartedly embraced and trusted something that at its core is so vulnerable and scary to do. I found out he was cheating on me with one of his clients, a 22 year old girl still living with her parents, and it went on for over a month. My question is I feel that I get triggered by anger and rage so much when I hear or read podcasts about cheating when they say cheating happens because there is something wrong in the relationship. I've asked my partner why was he not happy? And his answer is always I was happy. Our life was perfect and I was just stupid. I feel such deep emotions and feel that sometimes it's a cop out to say they were unhappy in a relationship, that's why he cheated on her, or there was something wrong, or she wasn't giving him enough sex, which wasn't the case at all our sex life, emotional life was good, but it still happened. Possibly I trusted him too much. But is that not what we are supposed to do in a loving relationship? Could it not just be the cheaters fault for cheating without throwing blame on the other partner or the relationship? I also still hold a lot of rage towards the girl. It's something that I'm still working through. Any advice?
Andrea Giles 30:28
Okay, so to begin with, I think our society has slapped so many labels on infidelity so many around. Oh, it must be that this is not happening in the marriage, just like are in the relationship. Not enough of this too much of this. She's to this. She's too pushy, whatever, okay. And in reality, yeah, we all have relationship dynamics, every single one of us like, just until we die, right? There's going to be dynamics in a relationship, it will never be perfect, it will never be perfect. Yes, that is a piece. But there's also this piece where people come into relationships with an opportunity to heal parts of them that have not been healed. And it sounds to me like in this relationship, that this was his work, this is his work to do that has been neglected, long before you came into the picture that it actually does not have anything to do with you. That's not to say that we don't take responsibility for you know, how we show up in our relationships, we still like we'd be doing ourselves a disservice if we just were like, Well, I had, it's not me, not me, look over there. And yeah, that you did not make the decisions, right, all of that. But just looking at some good questions are What is it like to be with me? What is it like to be in a relationship with me? Am I approachable? Am I like, how do I handle conflict? How do I if I have something that I want to talk about? What's my approach? Do I make it easy for somebody to hear me, right? This is an every relationship. Okay? So these are things to look at, for sure. Another thing to look at in I'm using air quotes, as I say this, like happy relationships, I believe that there are a lot of happier relationships were infidelity happens. But sometimes what that happiness is about is there might be some avoidance, like, are there some things that do feel off or that I want more of, but that I avoid to keep the peace and to keep us happy? Like really digging into that going, are there things that I really did have an issue with or that I wanted more of, or on both sides, but that I thought that to be happy, I needed to just like, deal with it and carry on and like, look at all the good and cup half full, and we do ourselves a disservice when we do that. We all do stupid things sometimes. And we can chalk it up to, you know, we're humans, and we're gonna do stupid things. But to really learn what we need to learn to not repeat it, we have to dig deeper. And to really look at what was happening for me, like when, when this person what why, how was I vulnerable? Because my guess is that this person did not just like I said, in the past question wasn't like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna go do this thing. I'm gonna get away with something, right? It was more like there was a vulnerability. There was something vulnerable, where this person offered something that felt that felt you felt something that that felt really good. Often, it's validation, often, like when we're feeling really insecure or shaky about things. Somebody's just offering us all this validation and telling us how wonderful we are. It feels amazing. It feels amazing. And so it can become literally it can become like a drug. It's like this massive dopamine hit. And then we look for the phone calls, we look for the text, we look for the and even the secrecy of it, that alone can be a real dopamine hit like we're getting away with something. And so I would say, him saying, I just did something stupid. Okay, but it's still not enough. It's still not what what's going to help build safety here is for you to see that he has some real understanding of what actually happened for him, where he was vulnerable. Where was Where did he let his guard down? Where did he let his walls down? Because where you're looking for is okay. So how do I know in the future, that this isn't going to happen again, the next time you are stressed at work, or if we're having an issue, that you're not going to let your guard down and let something else like this happen? How do I know that you are dealing with yourself that you're healing these parts of us so that you have better skills and tools and code The mechanisms and all of these things, so that I'm not putting myself at risk here, right by staying with you. Like you're a liability right now. That sounds harsh, but like if somebody is, if they're not dealing with their own issues and their own risk to themselves, they're putting the people around them in harm's way. coming at it from that angle, like a lot of times it can feel like such a such a shock, because like, I thought we were happy. How can I trust our happiness in the future? The way that I think about it, it has the potential here to go from being like Disneyland happy to digging of like, a long term, really deep well of wisdom, happiness, choosing, knowing, like wisdom, and I'd rather have wisdom over Disneyland happiness any day.
Amanda Durocher 35:58
Yes, me too. Yeah, I agree with that. Because to me, the word perfect. Our relationship was perfect. is a bit of a red flag. Yep. No relationship is perfect. Nope. Nothing really in life is perfect. No. So describing it as perfect to me is surface level, and is avoiding what's below that perfect exterior. The only things that are perfect to me are like the outside of a house that looks perfect. But we don't know what's going on behind the closed doors.
Andrea Giles 36:29
Yep, exactly. And one of the things that, that we do a lot is I know, for me growing up, the standard that I was kind of taught is oh, we never fight, right? We never fight. We're always kind we have such a great marriage, because we never fight. I remember hearing that from people. And that is what's described as a polite, pretend and parallel relationship where you're like, we're always kind to each other. We're always polite, and kind of living parallel lives where there's not like the real intimacy going on. This is where sometimes things blow up. Because we're missing these huge pieces. We're not really looking even at ourselves of what's really going on for us, we're avoiding it like crazy, like just polite, pretended parallel carry on, right? Look how happy we are looking at what a model we couple we are for all these other people, right? The opposite of that is when we're vulnerable, where there's radical truth, telling where we're really in it, and that is real intimacy. And that is where, like you said, Amanda, there is not ever going to be a perfect relationship, it does not exist. And so to say it is is a clue to me to like you said that, there's probably some things that have been avoided that have been worked around, like, we're not going to go through it, we're gonna go around it. And so we can still feel like this is just so perfect, right? And yeah, I say lean into the hard lean into the things that you might be have been avoiding. This is where something that is like, really deep and powerful and lasting, can be built is on honesty, transparency, vulnerability. And it's way better. Way better. Yeah.
Amanda Durocher 38:19
Yeah. And that vulnerability is often what we're craving. So many of people I know, I've been this way before, don't feel loved in a loving, quote, unquote, loving relationship. And what was lacking in my past in so many relationships, including friendships and family members, was that lack of vulnerability was that lack of true Trust, which was knowing if things got messy, these people would still be there?
Andrea Giles 38:45
Yeah, absolutely. Like, we all I think, have friendships that in hindsight, we can look at them and go, yeah, it was like, I'll tell you how great you are. You're telling me how great I am. And that's how our relationship works. And that's how a lot of relationships are at the beginning. Okay, you tell me what you want me to say to you? And I'll say it, and then you tell me what I want you to say. Yeah, right. And we go into these relationships, thinking that that's how it's always going to be, ah, and it's, it's not sometimes we do try to carry that on, but it's not reality. And like a real trusting relationship, like really, when we're doing the work is where we can actually hold a mirror to somebody else and show them themselves and say, This is what it's like to be married to you. This is my experience of you. And let it like loving them enough to do that loving them enough to let them see it.
Amanda Durocher 39:41
Yeah, I love that. The one other thing I wanted to add to this question was that I wanted to touch on the anger piece. This listener mentioned, the anger and the rage. I think that anger and rage get a bad rap. But I actually am a fan of these emotions. I think that anger and rage, when you can come into good relationship with your anger and rage have so much information for you. Your anger and rage are not there to punish you. They're there to show you what you need. And they're there to show you where your boundaries have been crossed, or what you've been ignoring. And anger and rage can feel so difficult because you've probably been ignoring something. And the anger and rage arise almost as a mirror of like, you can't ignore this, this is uncomfortable. And I think so many people are afraid of their anger and rage. And I talked about that sometimes on the podcast how so many of us, when we were younger, anger and rage were used against us, or when we express them as children, we were punished or told that they were bad emotions. So we hide our anger and rage, and then it comes out when we don't want it too. So I think such an important part of the healing journey is coming into relationship with your anger and rage.
Andrea Giles 41:00
I could not agree more just earlier this week, I was in my my group coaching program. And one of the people in there told me that she is still really struggling with rage towards the other woman and that she's just so mad. And it was her best friend for 15 years. That's who the affair partner was, it was really interesting to in asking her questions and exploring it deeper, she had not even she had not given herself permission to fully process it to like let herself be really angry, she would distract herself, she would try to try to analyze it in her mind. And really, it is still up to us to own what we do with our emotions, right? Like sometimes we might feel like slashing tires or things like that. It's still up to us to own what we do with our emotions, what actions we take from our emotions, but we get to feel them and and really the only way through is to fully allow ourselves to feel it. And so sometimes anger and rage, sometimes it looks like a physical thing that you allow to work through it. I remember in my first marriage when I was I knew that I was getting divorced. And it was just so painful. And I was so mad. I was so mad because I knew that it didn't have to be that way. Like if he would just tell me the truth. Like if there we could work through this. We had six kids like it was just devastating. I was devastated. And I was so mad, you know that I was in the position I was at my kids were my kids were doing Taekwondo at the time. And I decided to sign up for taekwondo. And I remember just kicking the heck out of the boards and out of the path things that we had, like I just it was such a good outlet for me at that time, because I could be mad, I could be really, really mad and have a physical outlet for it. And so I think that a good question to ask yourself is how much have I actually given myself permission to feel rage to feel angry, and then giving yourself places to let it out, like to process it, to feel it to give it a place to be like a safe place to be to come out to be seen? It's like pulling up a chair, like, Hey, I see you let's do this. Let's do this.
Amanda Durocher 43:16
Yeah, and I agree with finding a physical outlet for it to especially when I was at the beginning of like my rage journey. It was it needed to be expressed physically. And it needed to come out in different ways. And for me, I also needed to use my voice, which I felt like was taken from me. So I would sit in my car and I would just scream at the top of my lungs. Yeah, I felt like a safe environment. Because nobody was there. It was LA traffic. I mean, I had like, so much time in traffic and the car wouldn't move. And I would just scream at the top of my lungs to let it out. And also using nature is one I always recommend for safety, throwing rocks and water, hitting a tree and then thinking the tree or just pushing against a tree, like visualizing yourself just letting it out. But using different aspects of nature for me has been really healing in my relationship with rage, finding safe places for it.
Andrea Giles 44:14
Yeah, yep, it's there to serve us like in a loving way to be there for us. I agree. And another thing, another quick thing I'll add there is I'm imagining you and where you're felt the need to scream. Sometimes we can just pay attention to where we feel the rage in our body. And it might be that like our throat feels super constricted. We might be really sore in our neck, we might be so tight. And that's a signal to open up until like let your voice be heard to move those muscles to give them space to expand to be expressed. And notice like notice what's going on for your body or body will let you know where it needs to be heard essentially. So a lot of times we do feel like a tightness in our throat And that is an indication that we need to open up our throat and let our voice be heard.
Amanda Durocher 45:05
Yes, I love that. I think the healing journey does bring us back to the body, which so many of us are disconnected from. Yeah. And learning, for example, with this question, or with the question before with the resentment like we got where in your body? Is that emotion sitting? Yep. And getting to know that? What it's communicating? Yep,
Andrea Giles 45:23
exactly.
Amanda Durocher 45:23
Do you have anything else you'd like to any other advice or anything you'd like to offer this listener?
Andrea Giles 45:29
Just so much love? That's all just so much love. And I just, I know how none of us sign up for it. Right? None of us are like, Yeah, I think I'm going to do this, right. And yet, here we are, and just so much love, and just some encouragement that this is an opportunity to really dig deep, and even to look at aspects of yourself that maybe have not been healed. I think that these situations can show us like things from our past that needs to be healed, that become exposed to us through these situations. And so looking at the areas that as an opportunity to heal these parts that are now very prominent that we can see hurts that we've buried, just give yourself so much love, so much compassion for all of it. And it's a process. It's a process and take your time.
Amanda Durocher 46:23
And I think that's another example of healings, not linear, I think people often are talking about that with like, there's ups and downs, but it also goes like past forward. Like, you think you're just healing from this one thing. And then all of a sudden, you're sitting with your dad, and how he treated you as a child, or the way your mother treated you or how that teacher talked to you in the second grade. It's just not linear, we get caught in this web. And so I know this listener mentioned healing the layers, but there may be more to go farther and farther back, there may be more deeper things to dive into. And even a question I would begin to ask you is what was your mother's relationship like with her rage? What role models have you had with rage? And how has that affected you?
Andrea Giles 47:11
Yeah, what are you giving yourself permission to feel what who's like looking over your shoulder or telling you Oh, you've ended? That's too much. That's too much, or whatever that story is? And yeah, taking a look at it.
Amanda Durocher 47:24
And yes, thank you so much for this question. I'm sending you so much love as well. The healing journey is it feels long and daunting. But it really is just one step at a time. And the more you peel back the layers, the lighter it gets, I feel like Yeah, more, you just feel it in your body, which is what helps us to continue to move forward.
Andrea Giles 47:44
Yeah, I think it can shift from this place of feeling really stuck to knowing you might have a journey ahead of you, but knowing that you're moving.
Amanda Durocher 47:53
Thank you so much for being here today. How would people reach you if they were interested in connecting with you further?
Andrea Giles 48:01
Sure. So as Amanda mentioned, my podcast is heal from infidelity, on all different platforms, you can find that my website, you can find me on my website, Andrea giles.com. Social media, I'm sure Amanda will probably put links into the show notes. But yes, the biggest thing that I do like as far as my work with my clients is I run a group program, it's called no in 90. And it's a 90 day program where I help my clients really dig into the work of staying or going after infidelity. And then after that time is up, we stay in the same container for its for another nine months of where their support as they are really stepping into that decision. And sometimes the decision is to stay sometimes it's to go. And sometimes it's to really intentionally wait and collect data and to know exactly what you're looking for from a really peaceful place. So either way, you're getting to a place where you're out of that stuck. I just don't know what to do to clarity and moving forward and then having the support to move forward. Yeah, that's that's what it looks like to work with me.
Amanda Durocher 49:14
That sounds super powerful. I love that offering you.
Andrea Giles 49:17
Thank you.
Amanda Durocher 49:18
Wow, yeah, I'm sure that was cultivated after working with a lot of people on your own journey. So I'm sure there's a lot of great gems in there.
Andrea Giles 49:25
Thank you. I love it.
Amanda Durocher 49:27
So fun. And I just wanted to say thank you again for coming on the podcast, your wisdom here. And your advice was so wonderful. And I'm so glad that you agreed to come on and to share your wisdom with me and with the listeners and everyone who's a part of the newView advice community.
Andrea Giles 49:44
Well, thank you so much for having me sincerely. It was a pleasure. And I told Amanda this at the beginning before we were recording, but I really love the work that she's doing and shining a light on really hard topics. It's so needed. So it's an honor to be here. Thank you for having Amy,
Amanda Durocher 50:00
thank you. And I think the work you do is needed as well. And I love that you offer a shame free environment because as you mentioned, when it comes to cheating, there's so much shame. Yeah, there. So the more that we can offer safe spaces, I think the more healing that will happen, and I think that's beautiful.
Andrea Giles 50:17
Thank you very much. Thank you
Amanda Durocher 50:26
Thank you for joining me for today's episode. I hope you enjoyed this episode with Andrea Giles and I hope that we were able to offer you a new view on whatever you may be going through or a new perspective on infidelity or emotions or however this episode resonated for you today. If you have not already, I invite you to leave a rating and review for the podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, you can leave ratings on Spotify and Apple podcasts, ratings and reviews are a great way to support the podcast. So if you enjoyed today's episode, I invite you to leave a rating and review for the podcast. Thanks again for joining me for another episode of newView advice. As always, I am so grateful to be able to be here with you each week and to offer a new view on whatever you may be going through sending you all my love. See you next time
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